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	<title>Comments on: Ways You Can Recognize the Client From Hell</title>
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	<link>http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/</link>
	<description>Logo, Graphic and Web Design</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 26 Feb 2010 12:19:55 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Jody Sachse</title>
		<link>http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/comment-page-1/#comment-18766</link>
		<dc:creator>Jody Sachse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 Jan 2010 18:17:17 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I love this list... sometimes just managing the &quot;client from hell&quot; uses all the budget that was allotted for the site development and then some... Not to mention needing therapy afterwords.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love this list&#8230; sometimes just managing the &#8220;client from hell&#8221; uses all the budget that was allotted for the site development and then some&#8230; Not to mention needing therapy afterwords.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Ryde-Jones</title>
		<link>http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/comment-page-1/#comment-13685</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Ryde-Jones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 19:16:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/#comment-13685</guid>
		<description>&quot;It’s up to you.&quot;

Aargh, tell me about it. Had a client last year, wanted ultra-cheap website/forum/network for a music group. &quot;It&#039;s up to you.&quot;  I say MySpace will be the way to go: free, and it has a music option that&#039;s expressly targeted for exactly that role. &quot;It&#039;s up to you.&quot; I set up the MySpace, nicely customised so it doesn&#039;t look like a boilerplate MySpace page. And then the moans start. &quot;Oh, that wasn&#039;t quite what we wanted. People might be suspicious of a MySpace website because free space looks unprofessional. We want a domain and real webspace.&quot; I say that&#039;ll cost. &quot;Oh. Maybe we could cut the cost by getting my friend to collaborate with you.&quot; I say, in what I hope is a gentle joking way, f*** off, it&#039;ll still cost and I won&#039;t collaborate with someone without the least track record in computing or design. Let&#039;s talk about what&#039;ll work. Whoever does it, MySpace or FaceBook is all you&#039;ll get on the zero budget you have in mind. &quot;Oh.&quot; Then I find later in the day that the client - to whom I&#039;d given the password to show I&#039;m not the kind of control-freak web designer you hear horror stories about - has locked me out of the MySpace site and sent me a snotty e-mail about not being able to work together because of my being unprofessional and trying to control the project.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It’s up to you.&#8221;</p>
<p>Aargh, tell me about it. Had a client last year, wanted ultra-cheap website/forum/network for a music group. &#8220;It&#8217;s up to you.&#8221;  I say MySpace will be the way to go: free, and it has a music option that&#8217;s expressly targeted for exactly that role. &#8220;It&#8217;s up to you.&#8221; I set up the MySpace, nicely customised so it doesn&#8217;t look like a boilerplate MySpace page. And then the moans start. &#8220;Oh, that wasn&#8217;t quite what we wanted. People might be suspicious of a MySpace website because free space looks unprofessional. We want a domain and real webspace.&#8221; I say that&#8217;ll cost. &#8220;Oh. Maybe we could cut the cost by getting my friend to collaborate with you.&#8221; I say, in what I hope is a gentle joking way, f*** off, it&#8217;ll still cost and I won&#8217;t collaborate with someone without the least track record in computing or design. Let&#8217;s talk about what&#8217;ll work. Whoever does it, MySpace or FaceBook is all you&#8217;ll get on the zero budget you have in mind. &#8220;Oh.&#8221; Then I find later in the day that the client &#8211; to whom I&#8217;d given the password to show I&#8217;m not the kind of control-freak web designer you hear horror stories about &#8211; has locked me out of the MySpace site and sent me a snotty e-mail about not being able to work together because of my being unprofessional and trying to control the project.</p>
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		<title>By: Johnny</title>
		<link>http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/comment-page-1/#comment-5179</link>
		<dc:creator>Johnny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 13:12:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/#comment-5179</guid>
		<description>Oh yeah...  Love the clients that want sites featuring video, google ads, forms out the wazoo and interactivity but don&#039;t want to pay for anything but the template.  &quot;That stuff is easy, everyone knows how to do it so I shouldn&#039;t get charged for it!&quot;.   Hmmm, yes, that may be true but it still takes hours and hours and hours to create, idiot!  My time ain&#039;t for free ya know!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh yeah&#8230;  Love the clients that want sites featuring video, google ads, forms out the wazoo and interactivity but don&#8217;t want to pay for anything but the template.  &#8220;That stuff is easy, everyone knows how to do it so I shouldn&#8217;t get charged for it!&#8221;.   Hmmm, yes, that may be true but it still takes hours and hours and hours to create, idiot!  My time ain&#8217;t for free ya know!</p>
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		<title>By: Charlie</title>
		<link>http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/comment-page-1/#comment-5124</link>
		<dc:creator>Charlie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 03:03:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/#comment-5124</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;JaneD -&lt;/strong&gt;

Oh, man, that&#039;s a good one! Since I started this business, I&#039;ve had a handful of people ask me to make them &quot;Facebook, but better.&quot; Crazy. And with no budget because &quot;it shouldn&#039;t cost much if you&#039;re just copying something else, right?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>JaneD -</strong></p>
<p>Oh, man, that&#8217;s a good one! Since I started this business, I&#8217;ve had a handful of people ask me to make them &#8220;Facebook, but better.&#8221; Crazy. And with no budget because &#8220;it shouldn&#8217;t cost much if you&#8217;re just copying something else, right?&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: JaneD</title>
		<link>http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/comment-page-1/#comment-5121</link>
		<dc:creator>JaneD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 02:54:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/#comment-5121</guid>
		<description>How about clients that ask you to develop the next big application, but they have ZERO business skills, no original ideas and have not taken their vision a step beyond the app-envy phase.  i.e. &quot;I want my app to be like , but I don&#039;t want to think about the details, I don&#039;t have the money to properly fund the project and I need it yesterday.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How about clients that ask you to develop the next big application, but they have ZERO business skills, no original ideas and have not taken their vision a step beyond the app-envy phase.  i.e. &#8220;I want my app to be like , but I don&#8217;t want to think about the details, I don&#8217;t have the money to properly fund the project and I need it yesterday.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: johnny</title>
		<link>http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/comment-page-1/#comment-3210</link>
		<dc:creator>johnny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Mar 2009 14:17:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/#comment-3210</guid>
		<description>John, your situation has wrongs on both sides of the game.  

Illness:

If you were sick, you should have put someone in charge of the account while you were in the hospital.  You can&#039;t leave a client hanging for a week with no contact. You should at least have given them your hospital phone number so there could be NO WAY they can offer up excuses for not contacting you.  Sure, you can&#039;t get anything done on their project, but at least you are in contact.

Change your contract!  Mine has all deposit stipulations clearly marked as NON-REFUNDABLE.  

You shouldn&#039;t have to pay someone back for work accomplished, even if you are not still maintaining the site.  If it&#039;s up and running, she&#039;s using it.  Therefore, she needs to pay for it. Period.  Nobody gets design work for free and that&#039;s what she&#039;s trying to get here.

I&#039;d also write a clear, concise letter to your referring client and explain IN DETAIL what happened, regardless of the outcome.  It pays to cover your ass because otherwise this woman will run around town ruining your reputation.

Also:  12 pages of content with branding design for $895?  That&#039;s horribly low and she got a STEAL!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John, your situation has wrongs on both sides of the game.  </p>
<p>Illness:</p>
<p>If you were sick, you should have put someone in charge of the account while you were in the hospital.  You can&#8217;t leave a client hanging for a week with no contact. You should at least have given them your hospital phone number so there could be NO WAY they can offer up excuses for not contacting you.  Sure, you can&#8217;t get anything done on their project, but at least you are in contact.</p>
<p>Change your contract!  Mine has all deposit stipulations clearly marked as NON-REFUNDABLE.  </p>
<p>You shouldn&#8217;t have to pay someone back for work accomplished, even if you are not still maintaining the site.  If it&#8217;s up and running, she&#8217;s using it.  Therefore, she needs to pay for it. Period.  Nobody gets design work for free and that&#8217;s what she&#8217;s trying to get here.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d also write a clear, concise letter to your referring client and explain IN DETAIL what happened, regardless of the outcome.  It pays to cover your ass because otherwise this woman will run around town ruining your reputation.</p>
<p>Also:  12 pages of content with branding design for $895?  That&#8217;s horribly low and she got a STEAL!!!</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/comment-page-1/#comment-3154</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 03:36:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/#comment-3154</guid>
		<description>So I have to say I went through a bit of this today. Let me give you a play by play:
1. Client contacts me through a referral a couple of months ago
2. Client tells me exactly &quot;Do whatever, just make it professional and use shades of blue&quot;.
3. I draw up an agreement.
4. Client agrees. Pays upfront to take advantage of a discount. Project is slated for 4 to 8 weeks which is a real estate site.
5. Communicate with e-mails/phone calls. Also threw in some FREE (yes, said FREE) PC work she needed completed.
6. Client waits until end of development length to contact me and its two weeks after the period. I came out of the hospital from being critically ill for over a week and had been sick previously for 2 weeks. I was diagnosed with a potentially life-threatening cellulitis infection.  She is upset I didn&#039;t return a call she claims she sent while I was in the hospital.
7. Sends me an e-mail and states she wants the site complete but provides me no content for 8 pages so I&#039;m left to do it myself and did the best I can.
8. Tells me to discontinue work until we can meet. 
9. We meet and some gentleman who claims to be the marketing manager for her to create her &quot;brand&quot; is going off on me about how unprofessional the site is and how unprofessional I am. By the way. I don&#039;t know why a realtor with five listings needs a &quot;brand&quot; but anyways.
10.So I feel at this point I&#039;ve been setup by this &quot;client&quot; the whole time. She is requesting a full refund after I have put in over 50 hours worth of work or she will seek a lawyer. Her hook is the development timeline.
11.So I sign the damn agreement they drew up in literally 10 minutes. I just want this over with, not worth my time.
12.Did I mention she CC&#039;d a client that referred her on one of these e-mails she sent me?

I&#039;ll let you guys fill me in on the rest with your opinions. 

I will say this is the client from hell. I was not on with the timeline which I admit due to medical problems but this was a fully functioning Wordpress driven site with custom plugins written by my firm for real estate management plus a fully customized &quot;branded&quot; theme for $895.00 which she stated was &quot;very high&quot;. The design was professional with approximately 12 pages of content. 

The customer never provided me literally ANYTHING and told me that she pays me to make the decisions otherwise she could get her son to do it. The reason I&#039;m so apt to sign this agreement and make the payments back to her. Her referral was her daughter in law that works for a very large real estate firm that pays alot of my bills and I&#039;m sure she knew this.

Sorry for the long post but I had to vent about this somewhere. Thanks for reading.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So I have to say I went through a bit of this today. Let me give you a play by play:<br />
1. Client contacts me through a referral a couple of months ago<br />
2. Client tells me exactly &#8220;Do whatever, just make it professional and use shades of blue&#8221;.<br />
3. I draw up an agreement.<br />
4. Client agrees. Pays upfront to take advantage of a discount. Project is slated for 4 to 8 weeks which is a real estate site.<br />
5. Communicate with e-mails/phone calls. Also threw in some FREE (yes, said FREE) PC work she needed completed.<br />
6. Client waits until end of development length to contact me and its two weeks after the period. I came out of the hospital from being critically ill for over a week and had been sick previously for 2 weeks. I was diagnosed with a potentially life-threatening cellulitis infection.  She is upset I didn&#8217;t return a call she claims she sent while I was in the hospital.<br />
7. Sends me an e-mail and states she wants the site complete but provides me no content for 8 pages so I&#8217;m left to do it myself and did the best I can.<br />
8. Tells me to discontinue work until we can meet.<br />
9. We meet and some gentleman who claims to be the marketing manager for her to create her &#8220;brand&#8221; is going off on me about how unprofessional the site is and how unprofessional I am. By the way. I don&#8217;t know why a realtor with five listings needs a &#8220;brand&#8221; but anyways.<br />
10.So I feel at this point I&#8217;ve been setup by this &#8220;client&#8221; the whole time. She is requesting a full refund after I have put in over 50 hours worth of work or she will seek a lawyer. Her hook is the development timeline.<br />
11.So I sign the damn agreement they drew up in literally 10 minutes. I just want this over with, not worth my time.<br />
12.Did I mention she CC&#8217;d a client that referred her on one of these e-mails she sent me?</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll let you guys fill me in on the rest with your opinions. </p>
<p>I will say this is the client from hell. I was not on with the timeline which I admit due to medical problems but this was a fully functioning Wordpress driven site with custom plugins written by my firm for real estate management plus a fully customized &#8220;branded&#8221; theme for $895.00 which she stated was &#8220;very high&#8221;. The design was professional with approximately 12 pages of content. </p>
<p>The customer never provided me literally ANYTHING and told me that she pays me to make the decisions otherwise she could get her son to do it. The reason I&#8217;m so apt to sign this agreement and make the payments back to her. Her referral was her daughter in law that works for a very large real estate firm that pays alot of my bills and I&#8217;m sure she knew this.</p>
<p>Sorry for the long post but I had to vent about this somewhere. Thanks for reading.</p>
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		<title>By: Anna</title>
		<link>http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/comment-page-1/#comment-2940</link>
		<dc:creator>Anna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Feb 2009 23:24:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/#comment-2940</guid>
		<description>I can&#039;t resist commenting.  There are a couple I could add to your list. 

1. &quot;My friend told me that you offer a payment plan and I assumed it to be _______, so, now that the project is complete, I am now going to pay you _______ per week.&quot;

2.  Client raves about you and about his new website, until he receives the invoice for the agreed-upon price.  Then says that he is upset and that you need to handle his upset.  

There&#039;s more, but I&#039;ll leave it at that.  I have to say that one danger is being lax on contracts, because someone is a good friend of a friend or whatever.  Never again.

I have only done a bit of freelancing on the side, but at this point I have to say I really admire anyone who can stay with it full-time.  Your post warns me of what other future dangers might lie ahead - Thank you!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can&#8217;t resist commenting.  There are a couple I could add to your list. </p>
<p>1. &#8220;My friend told me that you offer a payment plan and I assumed it to be _______, so, now that the project is complete, I am now going to pay you _______ per week.&#8221;</p>
<p>2.  Client raves about you and about his new website, until he receives the invoice for the agreed-upon price.  Then says that he is upset and that you need to handle his upset.  </p>
<p>There&#8217;s more, but I&#8217;ll leave it at that.  I have to say that one danger is being lax on contracts, because someone is a good friend of a friend or whatever.  Never again.</p>
<p>I have only done a bit of freelancing on the side, but at this point I have to say I really admire anyone who can stay with it full-time.  Your post warns me of what other future dangers might lie ahead &#8211; Thank you!</p>
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		<title>By: erichansa</title>
		<link>http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/comment-page-1/#comment-1277</link>
		<dc:creator>erichansa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 15:19:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/#comment-1277</guid>
		<description>:)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> <img src='http://www.charfishdesign.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Johnny</title>
		<link>http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/comment-page-1/#comment-801</link>
		<dc:creator>Johnny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jul 2008 21:41:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.charfishdesign.com/freelancing/ways-you-can-recognize-the-client-from-hell/#comment-801</guid>
		<description>Love this list and it could grow three times as large too.

Here&#039;s some more:

1. Client shows the nearly finished project/logo/package design/etc. to his wife and she doesn&#039;t like it and now because some unrelated person to the entire design universe said &quot;I like red&quot;, you have to redesign.  Forget the fact that it&#039;s more money, (and if it&#039;s not, that&#039;s your fault for not having a great contract) I just want to MOVE ON with my life, please...

2. You submit 5 logo designs, all completely different directions to get a feel for where the client wants to go. (This happens a lot with midwesterners, they don&#039;t have a clue where they want to go).  Then they start mixing and matching looks that don&#039;t go together.  You do what they want anyway (against all the advice you could muster) and then they hate the final result.  Oh, nice!

3. Client thinks they can keep adding to the project parameters - (&quot;oh, just another page on the site&quot;, or my favorite, &#039;just a few more photos that you need to take and then photoshop to death and then add to the gallery section&quot; &quot;that shouldn&#039;t take you long, right?&quot;) yet does not want to pay a dime more for it, regardless that your contract was spelled out the the most infintessimal detail.

4. Client approves cost overruns on the phone during the project (Just do it, we&#039;ll worry about that later, I&#039;ll pay whatever it takes) then calls you up to complain about the final bill which all figures were approved beforehand by THEM.

5. And my favorite: Client decides they are suddenly a Design God and can design the job but still wants you to produce the final product wherein you basically are a production robot on a really horrid design and it sucks the soul from your life until the project is done.

After 30 years in the biz, I could go on and on...  suffice it to say I&#039;m ready to sh*tcan this career and be a fine artist full time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Love this list and it could grow three times as large too.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s some more:</p>
<p>1. Client shows the nearly finished project/logo/package design/etc. to his wife and she doesn&#8217;t like it and now because some unrelated person to the entire design universe said &#8220;I like red&#8221;, you have to redesign.  Forget the fact that it&#8217;s more money, (and if it&#8217;s not, that&#8217;s your fault for not having a great contract) I just want to MOVE ON with my life, please&#8230;</p>
<p>2. You submit 5 logo designs, all completely different directions to get a feel for where the client wants to go. (This happens a lot with midwesterners, they don&#8217;t have a clue where they want to go).  Then they start mixing and matching looks that don&#8217;t go together.  You do what they want anyway (against all the advice you could muster) and then they hate the final result.  Oh, nice!</p>
<p>3. Client thinks they can keep adding to the project parameters &#8211; (&#8220;oh, just another page on the site&#8221;, or my favorite, &#8216;just a few more photos that you need to take and then photoshop to death and then add to the gallery section&#8221; &#8220;that shouldn&#8217;t take you long, right?&#8221;) yet does not want to pay a dime more for it, regardless that your contract was spelled out the the most infintessimal detail.</p>
<p>4. Client approves cost overruns on the phone during the project (Just do it, we&#8217;ll worry about that later, I&#8217;ll pay whatever it takes) then calls you up to complain about the final bill which all figures were approved beforehand by THEM.</p>
<p>5. And my favorite: Client decides they are suddenly a Design God and can design the job but still wants you to produce the final product wherein you basically are a production robot on a really horrid design and it sucks the soul from your life until the project is done.</p>
<p>After 30 years in the biz, I could go on and on&#8230;  suffice it to say I&#8217;m ready to sh*tcan this career and be a fine artist full time.</p>
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